Out of Control: The New Biology of Machines, Social Systems, & the Economic World

"You know, they forced the cast of The Matrix to read this book before they started filming. A lot of the content was based on this book. The first paper on the idea that we may already be living in a computer simulation was published after the movie, and this book was the basis of The Matrix . It goes down this rabbit hole of where machines begin and end, and where we fit into that. The entire idea is that as we move into this revolutionary, technology-driven world, we then also become parts of that. An example would be genetic modification, implants, any type of medical devices. It’s just like this collision of both worlds, and we see a lot of that right now with internet technology as a whole, right? Google’s goal is that the internet will be everywhere, and that’s kind of where we’re at. The internet is sort of everywhere at this point. It doesn’t exist in one single area. You can talk to the internet on your phone, you can talk to the internet in your home, you can talk to the internet in your car. So when you talk about personal branding—well, where does it begin and end? Well, it begins and ends with you. “They forced the cast of The Matrix to read this book before they started filming” Coming back to your earlier question, is digital marketing personal branding, well, digital marketing or digital devices in general become very personal, and so they’re kind of one and the same, eventually. I think if we’re focusing so much on personal branding as a Facebook page or as an Instagram profile, or whatever tool you want to use, we’re really limiting ourselves. We need to think about how we think about all of it in general, and develop a philosophy . . . because the tools are going to change. They’ll always change, and you’re always going to have to learn a new one. That’ll be forever. But why we are doing it and what the purpose of it is, that I think is what needs to be redefined. That’s part of it. Well, I just think of it as an extension of myself. It’s this is what I’m doing and this is who I am, and these are what my goals are. My goal is to reach these kinds of people to do these kinds of things, and then I look at the tools and ask which one can benefit me the most in order to accomplish these goals. Then I figure it out from there. As my goal has changed, so do the tools, so does the image. But it’s goal-led. What are my personal goals? Because something else that happens is when you become really, really good at something and become known for something—maybe it’s social media or maybe it’s design—what happens when you don’t want to do that anymore? Support Five Books Five Books interviews are expensive to produce. If you're enjoying this interview, please support us by donating a small amount . You have to be able to see yourself before all of this, otherwise it’s just depressing. You end up just doing the same thing over and over again. For me, I mean, I had this whole identity: ‘ The Social Media Girl .’ Well, I’m not really a girl anymore. I’m in my 30s. I can’t really just be prancing around with this cartoon face any more. And also my goals have changed, right? Now I own a business, and I talk about technology in a different way, and I’ve learned a lot. The ability to transform ourselves comes from making sure that we’re thinking about ourselves first and then the goals. Then then it gets into strategy and tactics. If strategy and tactics are first, it’s just going to be this cycle of the same thing over and over again. There’s always new people coming up, so you just . . . you have to be rebuilding all of the time. The same guy that wrote that paper about how we’re probably living in a matrix is at Oxford University. He’s on the board of something called The Future of Life Institute . The Future of Life Institute talks about technology, and on the board were Stephen Hawking, when he was around, and a computer scientist named Stuart Russell who actually created artificial intelligence. He’s at Berkeley. Elon Musk is on the board too. It’s about 12 people. Big, big names, right? One of the names is Morgan Freeman. Why? His title is ‘science communicator.’ That’s such a perfect example of someone who’s got a growth strategy for their personal brand. He’s not just an actor now. He’s not just a face or a recognisable name. He’s also a science communicator. I think it’s brilliant. He took something he was interested in and he attached himself to it. He’ll never be a scientist, but he can be part of science. So that an example of what I’m talking about at a very high level. When you’re thinking about what your goals are and you’re putting yourself first, just some really interesting things can come out of it."